Okay, I know that it is not uncommon for men to stare or make comments about women’s looks/body parts. I must say, however, that part of me that thought this was more often done by a certain type of man—crude and the stereo-typical “man’s-man”. I know, call me naïve, but…that’s what I thought (or hoped).
So imagine my surprise when a “good guy” begins to tell me how he and his friends bring binoculars to the Red Sox games to stare at women’s breasts. He went on to say that when they have their digital cameras they zoom in on a particularly good-looking woman, take pictures of her body parts and then show each other. They all make their off-color comments then they’re off taking shots of the next unsuspecting woman. He was quick to add that they, of course, erase these pictures from the camera right after and would never think of keeping them (probably because they don’t want their wives to know?).
As an afterthought, he stated how it’s too bad that so many of the females with nice bodies are thirteen or so. He admitted that it doesn’t feel good to find out the girl was too young…but, he went on, ”We all know that as women get older everything begins to droop”.
As me and my drooping body are standing there, I’m certain my jaw has dropped so low it’s dragging on the floor. In my head I’m thinking, “Lisa, say something. Speak up for all women. Tell him the impact of this…blah, blah, blah” but I couldn’t. I was in such a state of disbelief. One, that he does this–that “all” men do this–and two, that he doesn’t even realize that it’s probably not the best idea to tell me he does it. Oh yeah, forget the fact that he doesn’t even realize this behavior isn’t okay…yeah, that got me too.
Okay, so here it is: just in case you think it’s okay to stare at and worse yet, take pictures of another person’s body parts without his/her permission…WAKE UP! That is offensive, creepy and an absolute boundary violation (to say the very least).
How would you like it if someone 200 yards away started zooming in on your private parts, talking about what they’d like to do with them? Or for men, how would you feel if women started taking pictures of men’s crouches…and laughed at their size?
Men are taking pictures with cell phones under women’s dresses, eyeing them at baseball games, and whistling at them on the street. Men, it’s time to wake up. Women are not pieces of meat to be ogled, pawed at, and violated. Grow up. It’s offensive and not okay, regardless of whether or not you get caught.
How would you like your daughters, wives, or sisters to be filmed from afar, stared at and leered at for their breasts, and seen as a piece of meat?
If you don’t want your daughters or wives to be on the receiving end of this, then don’t be on the perpetrating end. If you think a woman is attractive, great. Appreciate her beauty–don’t leer, ogle, whistle or go into dog mode… it/s simply unappealing, rude, and a huge turn off. Learn to respect women as people rather than body parts…your daughters, sisters and mothers will thank you for it.
Note: I realize this is not “all men” however, it seems to be more than many of us realize. If you are not one, than I thank you and encourage you to say things to any friends who may do the very behaviors that I’ve spoken about here.
Challenge: Men take a look at the messages you send about women. Are they respectful, angry, demeaning or cherishing? Pay attention to the examples you are setting for other men and boys about women; your sisters, mothers and wives will feel the brunt of these.
Sorry for the lack of sympathy, but this article is lousy. You can’t carry a gun into a bank and expect to get great customer service, just like you can’t put on sexy cloths and expect to be admired like an elephant’s ass. If women don’t like men looking at their boobs or noticing the hundreds of hours that they’ve spent on the stair master, wear a burqa.
Whether admiring an amazing rack or helping an old lady across the street, bottom line is, boys will be boys. Heaven forbid you walk into the bed room wearing your negligee only to be greeted by a yawn from you’re husband. I’m sure that would bother a woman far more than the flattery of finding out that the guys consider her to be picturesque from the other side of a baseball stadium.
My Reply: Dear Shawn,
Your point that women who dress provocatively are inviting men to stare at them is well taken. I don’t believe however, that anywhere in this post I said that the women were dressed provocatively…and nor did the man report that to me when he was relaying his story.
If a woman is wearing a negligee for her partner, that is obviously an appropriate time for the man to admire her. A woman sitting at a baseball game two hundred yards away from a stranger should not have to worry about having her breasts being photographed without her knowledge or consent.
Your assumption that the women would be flattered if they knew their breasts were being photographed from across the stadium is a huge assumption. This is the objectification of women and nothing more. It’s not admiring a woman. And it’s not flattering–it’s creepy and violating.
The notion of “boys will be boys” I don’t buy. In fact I think that notion is a cop out for men and I’ve seen many marraiges ruined because of it. To assume that men have the right to take pictures of women’s “amazing racks” as you so respectfully put it, is a dangerous assumption that laws have been formed around. Do you also believe that if women wear skirts, men have the right to take pictures up thier skirts?
The way you speak about women comes across as disrespectful and entitled. The idea that if women don’t want to be looked at, they should wear a burqa doesn’t give men much credit. I believe that men are capable of admiring women without objectifying them. I also believe that many men know that taking pictures of women’s body parts without thier consent is crossing the line–even if they choose to do it anyway.
What a classic response from what society may deem a typical male. If women don’t like something a man is doing then the woman should change? Blame the victim? That is ridiculous. The reason women wear the burqa is because men can’t control themselves, which is a cultural phenomenon not at all irrelevant to this response. If I were to observe a man overtly ogling my wife’s or daughter’s body I would have a problem with it and I would expect most men would. What the point of this post was, from my reading, was to point out that men are overstepping the line in their treatment of women in public. Even in public all people deserve to be treated with dignitiy and respect, regardless of how they dress.
As a parent and a male, I also take issue with the ‘boys will be boys’ philosophy. I think it to be a completely failed response that supports male inappropriateness that is perpetuated by men, and some women, who must think that males are hard wired to be that way. I disagree. All forms of violence in society are dominated by males, whether against women or other males. Almost all of the known causes of serious crime are socialization based, largely rooted in the family, and revolve around learning appropriateness or the lack of learning appropriateness. Judging from the choice of words in the response by Mr. Thomas, as well as his support of the ‘boys will be boys’ philosophy, he seems to be exactly the kind of person that perpetuates males being viewed as Neanderthals who cannot control themselves and may even believe this is the way it should be.
Dressing provocatively is one thing, admiring an attractive woman another. Ogling an unsuspecting female who is minding her own business and being foul about it is quite another. Boys may be boys, but they will be the boys we teach them to be, I will teach mine to be different. I encourage you to think about how you want your children to be treated in the future, teach your children how to act in that way now, and lead them towards treating all individuals with respect and digninty by acting in that manner yourself.
Hi Lisa, Jeb and Shawn,
I think this is a challenging subject, and I can see both sides of the debate.
On my feministic side, I agree that many men often lack containment of their lust. I think it’s disrespectful to approach a woman and tell her she has an “amazing rack” – clearly a boundary violation. I also empathize with the discomfort of someone zooming a digital camera into my private parts (although I’d probably laugh if someone did it to me personally). I grew up playing team sports, and I’ve been amazed at what men say in the locker room, a comfortable place to privately bond at the expense of female dignity. Interestingly, locker rooms also seem to be where I witness most outward expression of gay-bashing and racism.
I think many men lack the ability to show vulnerability (important for intimacy). I think men often supplement their feelings of disconnectedness with intensity. Fast cars. Loud music. High performance. Lust feels intense. Collaborative lust (between guys in a locker room, at a Red Sox game, etc) mixes that intensity with a pseudo-connectedness (“male bonding” or “boy’s night”). I think men struggle toward connectedness, but in sloppy crude ways. We accept the status quo because we’re afraid to be labeled a wuss or a pansy. Why? Probably because we fear social ostracism. It’s not easy to be a feministic man in a locker room of misogynists (and I speak from firsthand experience… and by the way I’m also a leading scorer on my hockey team). But that doesn’t make it right. It simply makes it difficult.
I think the approach of “imagine your sister or mother” is good for helping men to more clearly see the contamination of their “boys will be boys” logic. Another solution is to post offender’s picture on HollaBack ( http://hollabacknyc.blogspot.com/ ). It seems that most men promote “catcalling” and objectification of women in groups, especially in the mob mentality of locker rooms, but they’re too afraid to accept individual responsibility for those same actions and thoughts. Men enjoy objectification of women because it helps them feel connected and “alive,” but inside they know it’s wrong.
On my masculinistic side, I empathize with Shawn Thomas, the initial commenter. I understand what it’s like to be a boy entranced by a very attractive woman. I see at least 10 women each day that catch my eye. I also think lust can be a beautiful and natural thing as the fuel for romance and passion, and it is probably the trigger for men to “chase.” I’m almost done with a great book by Esther Perel (“Mating in Captivity”) that presents an interesting angle to the challenge of balancing intimacy and passion in relationships. I think she has does a great job presenting a balanced view of the challenges between men and women as she “reconciles the erotic and the domestic.”
I’m not smart enough to explain the neurochemical differences between the male and female brain, but I believe that men and women are wired differently for lust and passion. I also think there is some truth to John Gray’s statement “Men Are Like Blowtorches, Women Are Like Ovens.” We can look to the animal kingdom for examples of mating rituals, and often the male pursues while the female selectively allures – and the strongest male is often the one selected. Although women seem to have the same triggers of lust (I have female friends who confess to the “he has a nice butt” thoughts), I think there is something in men that brings them to action (or “lack of containment”). To some extent I think this is a combination of nature and nurture. A boy might be nurtured by his parents to objectify women (bad parenting), and he might also have inner natural urges to find a healthy mate that can bear his children (wide hips for baby-carrying, large breasts for baby-nursing).
My goal is neither to defend the animalistic biological energy of men, nor the idea that “spreading sperm” adds much value to society, but I don’t think many women deeply understand what it’s like to be a man. I think that male “chasing lust” can add wonderful value in building and sustaining a healthy relationship. I think women generally underestimate the challenges that men face in the locker rooms, and they sometimes lack empathy in their quick labeling of men as “creeps” and “perverts” (although those labels are often well-earned when I hear them).
The existence of misogynistic challenges don’t make sexual boundary violations right. I agree with Lisa’s approach of “saying things to any friends who may do the very behaviors that [she has] spoken about here.” It reminds me of Stetson Kennedy’s campaign to spread “frown power” in the pre-Civil-rights era. It’s scary to stand up against mass-endorsed evil like racism and patriarchy. Like Stetson Kennedy, Lisa might just be ahead of her time 🙂
Thanks Lisa for this great forum of healthy debate!
Regards,
Chris